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  #1 (permalink)  
Unread Apr 29th, 2005, 06:01 am
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Unhappy discipline and classroom management with uni/adult students

i have a few large university classes. if you are familiar with korean universities you probably know that it is hard to flunk a student so using that as leverage is difficult. how do you go about managing/controlling and discipling loud/unruly large classes? need help by monday

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Unread May 2nd, 2005, 02:01 am
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First you would have to make some rules and set them down the first day.

You also have to keep their attension so the activities should be interesting.
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Unread May 2nd, 2005, 10:59 am
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my activities are fairly interesting but i havent laid down the rules. i need to do that.
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Unread May 2nd, 2005, 06:41 pm
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One thing you should avoid is having your class develop a drop in center attitude.This happens when you get a lot of latecomers. In the past I used to have this. Its impossible to do a good job when everyone is arriving at different times. Sometimes your students will come up to you with all kinds of excuses why they can't come. Don't be fooled by their laid back attitude. Some of them are very two faced. They'll come up to you and cry that they can't attend your class and then talk behind your back to the administration. Be tough and don't take any****. If you lay down the law they will respect you.
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Unread May 2nd, 2005, 06:52 pm
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yeah, coming in late is a major problem. given this is my first semester at this school i am just getting the feel for how things work. at the start of next semester i'm laying down the law!

thanks for your suggestions. they are very helpful!

eric
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Unread May 2nd, 2005, 07:21 pm
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Quote:
Quote Oreamnos
yeah, coming in late is a major problem. given this is my first semester at this school i am just getting the feel for how things work. at the start of next semester i'm laying down the law!

thanks for your suggestions. they are very helpful!

eric
Isn't it strange how some students will come late on the first day. I remember seeing a great quote about that in a movie about a teacher who tried to get his students to find ten people and help them. I forget the title of the movie but he makes a great quote about showing up on the first day late is the ultimate sign of disrespect. I studied sculpture in University under a teacher who was in the Korean war. If you showed up late he had this bad *** nasty stare he'd give you. It really worked becouse most people came on time. He only had to do it once.
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Unread May 3rd, 2005, 03:18 pm
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I type up a classroom rules sheet and pass it out to all students - and I keep copies for students coming into the class throughout the semester.

If you have a syllabus that shows your grading method, include 10% for attendence & being on time. Basically, 5 + mintues late (unless they have an excuse the mafia would kill for) is considered tardy. I add up the total number of days for the semester and then figure out the % they earned: example - 50 days (3 absenses & 2 tardies = 90%, which then equals 9% of that portion of the grade). Did that make sense?

Also, whenever a student is giving major attitude I tell them to go home and then I ask the rest of the students "Does anyone else have a problem? If you do, there's the door. No? No one? Are the rest of you ready to work? Good."

Usually one very pissed off, but embarrased student keeps the other in line.

A bit hard-nosed, yes, BUT they know I mean business. And truthfully, the rest of the class time goes by mighty smoothly after something like that. The students still learn and in my class still have some fun and laugh.
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Unread May 3rd, 2005, 06:26 pm
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Quote:
Quote sighisoara
I type up a classroom rules sheet and pass it out to all students - and I keep copies for students coming into the class throughout the semester.

If you have a syllabus that shows your grading method, include 10% for attendence & being on time. Basically, 5 + mintues late (unless they have an excuse the mafia would kill for) is considered tardy. I add up the total number of days for the semester and then figure out the % they earned: example - 50 days (3 absenses & 2 tardies = 90%, which then equals 9% of that portion of the grade). Did that make sense?

Also, whenever a student is giving major attitude I tell them to go home and then I ask the rest of the students "Does anyone else have a problem? If you do, there's the door. No? No one? Are the rest of you ready to work? Good."

Usually one very pissed off, but embarrased student keeps the other in line.

A bit hard-nosed, yes, BUT they know I mean business. And truthfully, the rest of the class time goes by mighty smoothly after something like that. The students still learn and in my class still have some fun and laugh.
I agree 100% with what you have to say. Being soft on your student will backfire almost 100% of the time. For example if you are lenient on your students they will take advantage of it. Eventially one of your supervisers will notice and pick out several students and ask why attendance is poor or why so many students came in late. They will almost always make some complaint about your quality of teaching. Most of these students are two faced. They will use one hand to exchange soju glasses and with the other they will stab you in the back.
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Unread May 3rd, 2005, 06:43 pm
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Great! thanks for help!
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Unread Dec 9th, 2005, 07:15 am
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Default Re: discipline and classroom management with uni/adult students

I am constantly on my feet, walking around the room. I carry my bound stack of notecards (with sticker photos) they did the first week and try to ID them. . . most are not offended if you don't match them to their old HS photo. I started checking books each day, now I note quietly in my attendance sheet "nb" (no book) or "nwb" (no work book) and "nw" (not working). . .by week 2 or 3 someone discovers this, asks me about it, and realized, oops, she's paying attention. I explain that it's the only way I can give a proper participation grade, 20% of the total. If the class is noisy, I stop and smile-- this has taken up to 15 minutes-- after all 50 loud people sometimes must notice. I explain that I do not want to interrupt them, as that's rude. I stop each time a noise builds. And smile. Hard-line might work for many, but rules (handed out in Eng and Kor and kept to a minimum) given early on and then quiet, friendly consequences, work best for me.

Public humiliation doesn't work, at HS at home or here. It builds up resentment from the whole class. Losing it is never good, as it shows YOU are not even in control of yourself. I'd rather let them go 15 minutes early than yell, degrading not just the students (a few of whom want to be there!) but myself.

Some of this boils down to person style, but after 4 years teaching Uni in Korea, 2 in the US, plus HS for years stateside, some subbing K-12 and volunteering/guesting at schools on several continents, being nice, patient, and genuinely interested in your students helps. Get to know them (or some) as individuals and don't judge them by the norms of the era and culture you were raised/went to school. Share some of yourself. Even if 85% understand les than 15% of what they say, they pick up on your attitude.

I've overheard teachers at the Unis I've worked at yell (Korean and Western teachers) and I've heard foreign teachers complain how "dumb" their students are. . . well, judged on my ability to communicate in French, much less Korean, I'd be judged somewhere around early elementary level (or 3-4 year old Korean).

As I walk around the classroom, continuously, I check their books (pointing out errors individually-- later I cover problems many students had with a mini-lesson on the board), and also comment on their T-shirt, the picture of their girlfriend, etc. I ask them questions. . . before I travel to a new city, for example, I check my index-cards and if there is a student from there I will say, "Next week I'm going to Gurye. . . which way do I exit the station to get . . ." etc. Even if it's my worst student, he is psyched and wants to help!

I am fortunate to have writing classes, including advanced electives. I encourage students to go beyond: I am 21. I am a XXUniversity student. My major is police. My family is 4, mother, father, younger brother and me. I am from XXX. My hobby is sing a song and video game. These are forbidden sentences in my class. I read their journals, glean for clues about them, and start asking questions. Sometime I ask a question at the top of a new page and suggest they write the answer below.

"Don't let the "15 hour" weeks fool you! Uni teaching is time-consuming, but can be fun!! You can go out drinking with your students and they pay!! I try to do much of my work in busses, trains, etc. . .

Hope this is coherent and helps; it is the end of the semester and I should be working and not on the computer!!
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Unread Dec 9th, 2005, 08:17 pm
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Default Re: discipline and classroom management with uni/adult students

very helpful. this semester i started the nb, nwb, etc... notes. that has made a difference. i like the photo idea, though, as it took me nearly 2 semesters to learn names. once you know names you really gain a lot more control of the class.

appreciate the help!

eric
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  #12 (permalink)  
Unread Dec 11th, 2005, 06:38 am
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Default Re: discipline and classroom management with uni/adult students

Other clues to look for: names on books (though students sometimes "share" with students in other classes, so check yer role), jewelry, phones, books for other classes that they have out (for shame!). . . sometimes I just ask, but it doesn't match the flabergasted look they have if I come right out and ask them by name. . . also, some actually fill in their workbook excercises with their names (or a partners). . . and they "think" I just remember. . . and after a while, I do (sometimes). If a student, say, leaves for a 20 minute bathroom break (and I do try to catch them if they take their cell phone to the bathroom), I usually ask the kid next to them if I don't find the name thumbing through their English book. . . word gets back, and it can be done very subtly, without disrupting the class or humiliating the student. . . my role code for that is "20 minute bathroom break" (takes a few of those attendance blocks) or "bailed" if they don't come back until 5 minutes before class ends. On the other hand, little +s appear on my role about week 3, and soon students learn that I also notice them WORKING! These figure in a + .5 to 1 point on their final grade! I try for 2/1 positive comments (using names) and try to be fairly discreet with the negs. . . the word gets out, without you having to announce who is NOT doing what to the entire class.
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Unread Feb 11th, 2006, 11:17 am
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Default Re: discipline and classroom management with uni/adult students

How about locking the door? Once the class starts if you are not there then you will miss the class or make them pay a penatly for arriving late. For example reading or doing a skit or something in front of the class. Korean students are quite shy and hate to do things that will embarass themselves in front of their classmates

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P.S> If any of your students ask you about studying abroad please refer them to my website. We have partnered with a company in Seoul where they can go to get more information as well

Thanks
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